ELIWLAD GRANDSON OF UTHER AND MADOG AILITHIR
SON OF SAWYL: MY FINAL STATEMENT ON A POSSIBLE
ARTHURIAN-SARMATIAN CONNECTION
Maponus Stone From Ribchester
The following post represents some selections from previous studies dealing with the personal name Eliwlad and with Sawyl Benisel of Ribchester. I've now come to the conclusion that Eliwlad does, in fact, represent a Welsh attempt to render Irish Ailithir. No other proposed etymology for the name Eliwlad works. One can, with considerable difficulty, concoct a few three part names beginning with the El- prefix ('many'), but the problem with this is that we do not, anywhere, have comparanda for such a formation. In other words, all extant El- names are composed of only two elements. Thus it is highly improbable that any postulated three-part El- name can be allowed. In addition, if we seek a two-part El- name, no etymology is forthcoming from -iwlad.
Professor Marged Haycock (personal correspondence) did come up with what looked like a promising etymology:
"Possibly elyf/elyw + gwlad in the ‘flaith’ sense. Lord who has cattle, riches. etc."
But Dr. Simon Rodway stressed that this was not possible:
"In the Black Book of Carmarthen orthography, eliw stands regularly for elyf, plural of alaf, not for eliw, which is what we consistently have with Eliwlad. In other words, in the MSS in which Eliwlad occurs, i is not otherwise used for y. Elyf (a pl.) + gwlad isn't at all compelling on formal grounds, anyway."
And Prof. Peter Schrijver agreed with him on this point:
"Simon certainly knowns what he is talking about, and to assume that consistent -i- in Eliwlad stands for -y-, as your etymology would presuppose, is problematic (unless it is a fossilized name, which seems to me unlikely because *elyf-wlad should be an eminently transparent compound)."
There thus seems to be no four-letter sequence that could possibly compose the first element of the name.
http://mistshadows.blogspot.com/2016/09/a-second-preferred-etymology-for.html
While this idea seemed great at the time, I had neglected to check on one very important thing, viz. whether such a name-form was supported by the corpus of early and medieval Welsh names. As it turns out, such is not the case.
Eliwlad as 'Prince of [the region] Eli' or, more literally, Eli-prince, does not yield any corollaries in Welsh personal names. The same goes for 'Prince of Elei', perhaps a reference to Mabon the predatory bird of Elei in the PA GUR. While Dr. Simon Rodway of The University of Wales says that Elei-gwlad for Eliwlad is possible linguistically, it does not work for the same reason Eli-prince does not work. Simply put, I could not find even one additional example of a place-name as an initial component, followed by a descriptor such as gwlad. This means the proposed etymology is fatally flawed.
Arguing against any use of gwlad as "prince" in Welsh is the mere fact that this word is regularly used only to mean 'land' and the like. For 'prince' we find the very well-attested gwledig. There may exist a couple exceptions to the rule. The following selection is from Thomas Charles-Edwards' ‘The Date of Culhwch ac Olwen’ in Bile ós Chrannaib: A Festschrift for William Gillies, edited by Wilson McLeod, Abigail Burnyeat, Domhnall Uilleam Stiùbhart, Thomas Owen Clancy and Roibeard Ó Maolalaigh, Ceann Drochaid, 2010, pp. 50-51:
"Another possible old word that was not understood is gwlad in the sense of ‘lord, ruler’. In
one of the poems ascribed to Taliesin, his patron, Urien of Rheged, is praised by comparison:
gwacsa gwlat da wrth Urföen.
In the context, this ought to mean, ‘Useless is a good lord compared with Urien’. Although in
Middle and Modern Welsh gwlad means ‘country’ or ‘kingdom’, its Irish cognate, flaith, has
a triple meaning, ‘lordship; kingdom; lord’. This example makes it likely that in early Welsh,
gwlad could have at least a double meaning, ‘lord’ and ‘country’. A further likely example is
in Culhwch. The phrase mab brenhin gvlat teithiawc in lines 90–1 has a parallel in line 95,
mabyon gwladoed ereill, where ereill shows that the text is referring back to the earlier
phrase. This makes it likely that brenhin here is an embedded gloss, so that the contrast was
between map gvlat teithiawc [son of a wandering prince?] and mabyon gwladoed ereill [sons of other princes?]. The mabyon gwladoed ereill were to be housed in the yspyty, whereas the mab (brenhin) gvlat teithiawc would be allowed through the gate so as to enter the hall: hence the gwladoed ereill would appear to be rulers of lesser rank than a brenhin or gwlat teithiauc. This in turn makes it likely that gvlat in lines 90–1 and 95 should not be taken in the later sense of ‘major kingdom’, such as Gwynedd or Powys. The adjective teithiawc was regularly applied to a person or an animal but not to a country."
Welsh does have an allwlad, although it is only attested late. Here it is from the GPC:
allwlad
[all-+gwlad]
eg.b. (adran (a)) ac eb. (adran (b)) a hefyd fel a.
a Estronwr, dieithryn:
• foreigner, stranger.
1567 LlGG 89a, Yr awrhon nid ych na diethreit nac allwlat.
1567 TN 129a, A wyt ti yn unic yn ddiethr [:- allwlat] yn Caerusalem?
1604-7 TW (Pen 228) d.g. Alienigena.
1632 D.
1722 Llst 190, Allwlad. c.g. A forreigner.
1770 W d.g. An alien.
b Gwlad estron:
foreign land.
18-19g. MA ii. 365, [y] bobl groylon hyn a dathoed o allwlat.
[1862] Ieuan Glan Geirionydd: G 127, Ei mam dirion, mewn gwlad estronol, / Mewn ing o’i herwydd mae’n angeiriol; / … / Athrist, a hi’n ddieithrol—mewn all-wlad, / Trwy sâd gamsyniad yn absenol [Awdl Farwnad y Dywysoges Charlotte].
Fel a. Ecsotig, dieithr, estron, tramor:
exotic, strange, foreign, alien.
1650 B xxii. 142, nhwy a dhychwelon yn i hol i’r ynys ag a dhifethan y gormesiaid anghyfiaith a’r treiswyr alhwlad.
1793 P, Allwlad … foreign.
[1860] Addysg Chambers ii. 253, Er fod y rhan fwyaf o’r planhigion … yn rhai brodorol, etto y mae yno luaws mawr o rai allwlad wedi eu cywladu.
I did ask Dr. Simon Rodway whether this word was necessarily only a late "concoction" or if it could possibly have been used much earlier. He responded thus:
"I can't see any reason why it couldn't be an old compound."
Eliwlad is found in the Welsh didactic poem 'The Dialogue of Arthur and the Eagle'. The text of this poem may be found in Jenny Rowland's EARLY WELSH SAGA POETRY, while a translation (which Rowland assisted with) can be found in the pamphlet"Arthur's Talk With the Eagle" by Gwyneth Lewis (Tavern Books, 2010). Ifor Williams' text can be found at the following link, and I am posting his version as a footnote [1] below: http://www.ancienttexts.org/library/celtic/ctexts/eagle-w.html. The English translation available at http://www.ancienttexts.org/library/celtic/ctexts/eagle.html is very old and, in my estimation, not reliable. The best recent scholarly translation and detailed discussion can be found in Nerys Ann Jones's ARTHUR IN EARLY WELSH POETRY.
For an important post on Ribchester's relationship with York, see https://mistshadows.blogspot.com/2018/10/bremetennacum-and-eboracum-special.html. And for Maponus (= Mabon, Uther Pendragon's "servant") at Ribchester, see https://romaninscriptionsofbritain.org/inscriptions/583.
On the date and significance of 'The Dialogue of Arthur and the Eagle', here is a brief discussion by Thomas Green in his Arthuriana: Early Arthurian Tradition and the Origins of the Legend, pp. 267-8:
To this we might add what Bromwich has to say on Eliwlad in her TRIADS, p. 346:
As for the name Sawyl Benisel, father of Matoc/Madog - as it is found in the Irish sources - this account is definitive:
from EARLY LITERARY CHANNELS BETWEEN IRELAND AND BRITAIN
Clark Harris Slover
Studies in English
No. 7 (November 15, 1927)
"The scoliast's preface to the Hymn of Sanctan in the Irish Liber Hymnorum contains the statement that the author made the hymn as he was going from Clonard westward to Inis Matoc. He was a brother to Matoc and had followed him to Ireland, and they were both Britons. Sanctan did not have the knowledge of the Irish language up to that hour, but God gave it to him quickly. Confirmation of the British origin of Sanctan and Matoc is afforded by the LL tract on the mothers of Irish saints, where we find that Dechtire, daughter of Muiredach Muinderg, king of Ulster, was wife of Samuel Chendisil, and had two sons, Sanctan and Matoc.
Samuel Chendisil is the same as the Samuel Pennissel of Welsh tradition. The name means "low-head." He is mentioned in the tenth-century genealogies attached to the Historia Britonum in MS Harleian 3859 as son of Pappo Post Priten. He appears also in Geoffrey of Monmouth's Historia regum Brittaniae (III, 19) as successor of Rydderch in the kingship. The relation between him and Samuel Bennuchel ("high-head") is interesting. Samuel Bennuchel is mentioned in the Welsh Triads as one of the three haughty men of Britain, and also as a member of King Arthur's court in the romance of Kulwch and Olwein.
There is no doubt that they are one and the same person, for the genealogies from MS Hengwrt 536 (14th cent.) substitute Sawyl Penuchel for Samuel Pennissel as son of Pappo Post Priten, and the Brut Tyssilio, a Welsh redaction of Geoffrey's Historia, makes a similar substitution. J. Loth thinks that the substitution first occurred in the Triads; that the writer, feeling that "low-head" was a poor name for a haughty man, changed the original name Pennissel to Pennuchel ("high-head") .
Various Irish references to Sanctan show that the same confusion obtained in Ireland. The passage in the Book of Leinster already quoted says he was son of Cendissel ("low-head"). Another reference to Sanctan is glossed cendmar ("great head") .Still another refers to bishops Santan, Sanctan, and Lethan as sons of the British king Cantoin. Whatever this last name may mean, it falls in with the others in this tradition, for it contains the cenn ("head") element."
***
I have discovered in early Irish sources variant spellings for Irish ailithir, "pilgrim, foreigner" (literally, aile + tir, 'other land'), an epithet for St. Madog son of Sawyl Penisel (or Penuchel). One of these spellings was Elithir. This last example satisfied the requirement of Eliwlad, the first element of which could not directly be derived from the Welsh cognate of Irish aile/eile, i.e. 'all' (although see below under SCHOLARLY SUPPORT FOR ELIWLAD = AILITHIR/ELITHIR). Welsh has alltud, 'other people/country', allfro, 'other land', and the late occurring allwlad, 'other country', for "foreigner." In Welsh, ail/eil is "second."
Here are some of the books providing the spelling Elithir:
Etc. - including the actual texts alluded to in these sources, some of which are available online.
In other words, I could make an argument again for Eliwlad being 'other land', an exact equivalent of the Irish Ailithir epithet given to Madog son of Sawyl.
Oliver J. Padel in ARTHUR IN MEDIEVAL WELSH LITERATURE states that
“Barry Lewis has pointed out that a sixteenth-century dialogue between a creiriwr [crair + -iwr in the GPC] (‘pilgrim’) and Mary Magdalene of Brynbuga (the town of Usk) is remarkably similar in both form and content to the dialogue with the Eagle…”
As this comparative treatment of the two poems appears to be accurate, and if I am right about Eliwlad being an interpretation or attempted translation of Ailithir, then we have two nearly identical poems featuring characters named ‘Pilgrim’. I have found the text of the Mary Magdalene/creiriwr poem here: https://books.google.com/books?id=pavuAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA318&lpg=PA318&dq=mary+magdalene+brynbuga+pilgrim&source=bl&ots=8OqWJ7aJOM&sig=ACfU3U2Hl0CeSUhpnmMMa8kwzFH6EB63pw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjn-YD-4uPgAhUCoZ4KHUBkCHoQ6AEwCXoECAQQAQ#v=onepage&q=mary%20magdalene%20brynbuga%20pilgrim&f=false.:
SCHOLARLY SUPPORT FOR ELIWLAD = AILITHIR/ELITHIR
"Your proposal to understand Eliwlad as a W 'translation' of Ir Ailithir looks quite attactive. Eli- might well stand for Ir ail(e), and tir is correctly translated as 'gwlad'. The respective range of meaning of both words is, of course, not perfectly identical.
If 'pilgrim' really is the "primary meaning" of ailithir, then this word is beyond any doubt a bahuvrîhi compound, designating somebody 'who is characterized by another [foreign] land', obviously in the sense that (s)he has visited a [remarkably] foreign land, is acquainted with it, etc.
Professor Stefan Zimmer
[As a side note, Professor Zimmer may, inadvertently, have provided a good explanation for why the Lleu death-eagle motif was borrowed from the MABINOGION by the author of the 'Dialogue':
"We have to remind of an alternative, however, viz. that the 'other land' referred to might be the 'Otherworld' , so that the bearer of the epithet may have been named so for assumed/desired magical qualities."
What seems obvious to me is that Ailithir/Eliwlad was interpreted as being a designation for the Otherworld, a land of spirits who could assume the form of animals or birds. This alone would be sufficient to account for the presence of the spectral eagle in the poem.]
"Irish aili- does not have a diphthong ai in the first syllable but a fronted low simple vowel [ae] (approximately as in Engl. back) followed by a palatalized -l´-. I find it quite plausible that this would have been borrowed immediately as W eli-.
Professor Doctor Peter Schrijver
“I don’t disagree with anything Zimmer or Schrijver say."
Dr. Simon Rodway
“I think that -wlad cannot be anything else but gwlad 'country', and your idea that Eliwlad is a reinterpretation of Ailithir seems plausible to me. If Eliwlad developed directly from the British, we would expect *Eilwlad."
Professor Ranko Matasovic
“It looks perfectly possible to me that Eliwlad represents British *Aljowlatos 'other land'. Eliwlad/t is a plausible rendering of Eilwlad. One certainly finds occasional <e> for <ei> in MW, and metathesis is always possible. If it’s not from *aljo-, I have no idea.”
Professor Richard Coates
Alan James
“First it appears to me that you you must be right in identifying gwlad as the second element. This is indeed the regular cognate of flaith in Irish, but the latter, a feminine i-stem, originally also had an abstract meaning ‘lordship, sovereignty’, and its application to a person is a secondary process in Irish (retaining the feminine gender!) for which there are several parallels, such as techt meaning not only ‘going’ but also ‘messenger’, cerd both ‘craft’ and ‘craftsman’, etc.
Your proposed adaptation of aili- to eli-, on the other hand, would have to have been purely formal, since Irish and British continue two different variants of the same word ‘other’, Ir. aile (also 'second') < *aljo- and e.g. Middle Welsh. all < *allo-. British ail, 'second', is from *aljo-.
But apart from this formal misgiving, I do admit that your derivation would make for a nice contextual fit!“
Professor Jurgen Uhlich
THE ANCIENT ELEGY FOR UTHER AND THE NAME SAWYL
In Marged Haycock's translation of the MARWNAT VTHYR PEN, the 'Death-Song of Uther Pen[dragon],' we appear to find the chieftain actually calling himself Sawyl. This is what Haycock has in her notes to Line 7 of this elegy:
7 eil kawyl yn ardu G emends kawyl > Sawyl, the personal name (from Samuelis
via *Safwyl). Sawyl Ben Uchel is named with Pasgen and Rhun as one of the
Three Arrogant Men, Triad 23, as a combative tyrant in Vita Cadoci (VSB 58);
and in CO 344-5. Samuil Pennissel in genealogies, EWGT 12 (later Benuchel),
Irish sources, and in Geoffrey of Monmouth. Other Sawyls include a son of
Llywarch, and the saint commemorated in Llansawel: see further TYP3 496,
WCD 581 and CO 104. Ardu ‘darkness, gloom; dark, dreadful (GPC), sometimes
collocated with afyrdwl ‘sad; sadness’ (see G, GPC).
Initially, I refused to get too excited about Uther calling himself a 'second Samuel'. I mean, this was, after all, an emendation. However, I asked Welsh language expert Dr. Simon Rodway of The University of Wales about the authority who made this emendation - one that was accepted by Haycock herself. Our discussion on this matter ran as follows:
"Geirfa Barddoniaeth Gynnar Gymraeg, by John Lloyd-Jones...
Cited several times by Marged Haycock in her edition of the Uther poem, and she adopts many of his emendations.
A trustworthy, well-respected source, in your opinion? Or is his work somewhat outdated or even obsolete?"
"It’s a very good piece of work, which I often use. It’s much more comprehensive than GPC [Geiriadur Prifysgol Cymru, 'Dictionary of the Welsh Language']."
Such an unqualified, professional academic opinion of Lloyd-Jones changed everything!
As for how the error could have occurred, Dr. Rodway suggested the following scenario:
"It can’t be a case of miscopying a letter, but it could be eye-skip - when a copyist’s eye skips inadvertently to another nearby word resulting in an error. In this case, he would have eye-skipped to the preceding line's 'kawell' to get the /k-/ fronting what should have been 'sawyl'. Was not an uncommon error, so quite plausible. Also, kawell and kawyl are unlikely to be the same word. The poets avoided repeating words in consecutive lines. In cases where this does occur (very rare) it could be scribal error."
The important first several lines of the elegy can be translated as follows:
Neu vi luossawc yn trydar:
It is I who commands hosts in battle:
ny pheidwn rwg deu lu heb wyar.
I’d not give up between two forces without bloodshed.
Neu vi a elwir gorlassar:
It’s I who’s styled 'Gorlassar' [= Geoffrey of Monmouth's Gorlois]:
vy gwrys bu enuys y’m hescar.
my ferocity snared my enemy.
Neu vi tywyssawc yn tywyll:
It is I who’s a leader in darkness:
a’m rithwy am dwy pen kawell.
Our God, Chief of the Sanctuary [kawell with the meaning of cafell
here; see Note 2 below], transforms me:
Neu vi eil Sawyl yn ardu:
It’s I who’s a second Sawyl in the gloom:
ny pheidwn heb wyar rwg deu lu.
I’d not give up the fight between two forces without bloodshed.
GORLASSAR
The allusion to Sawyl/Samuel and the sanctuary plainly refers to the Biblical Samuel, who received his call as prophet from Yahweh while sleeping at night in the Shiloh sanctuary.
But what about Gorlassar? For it is this descriptor, meaning literally 'very blue or very green or very blue-green' (or even a very bluish or greenish grey), which Geoffrey converts into the separate personage of Gorlois. In Geoffrey's tale, Uther is transformed by Merlin into Gorlois. But in the elegy the one who transforms Uther is none other than God. And the actual transformation is into the second Sawyl, the Biblical Samuel being the first, of course.
What, then, is the significance of gorlassar in this context?
I had flirted with the notion that 'kawyl' was an error for cannwyll, defined in the GPC as follows:
"candle, luminary, transf. of star, sun, moon, lamp; fig. of light, brightness, instruction, leader, hero"
This is a possible error, according to Dr. Rodway:
"A copyist might have missed an n-suspension over the a, and single n for double nn is quite common in Middle Welsh MSS."
As "star" is a transferred meaning of cannwyll, and "gloom" is mentioned in the same line, I sought to link kawyl to the dragon-star in Geoffrey of Monmouth's story. The problem with this idea is that whatever or whoever kawyl is, it is the object or subject of the transformation by God in the previous line. Given the pronounced military aspect of the poem, a supposed transformation by God into a star seems out of context. Even if we take this figuratively, i.e. that cannwyll means leader, Uther was already designated that 2 lines up. That would make this reference not only unduly repetitive, but redundant.
'Eil' is also a bit of a problem, as it can mean 'second', 'like or similar to' or 'descendant of' (cf. the well-known example of Dylan eil Ton). But, again, as Uther is transformed, he can't merely be like something or similar to something. Nor does it make sense for him to be transformed into the descendant of someone. He must become a second _awyl and this strongly suggests the _awyl in question is a person. A second cannwyll would make sense only if God in the preceding line were the first such. The transformation of Uther into Sawyl would be in keeping with the Arthur birth story, which echoes the birth stories of both Hercules and the Irish Mongan son of Fiachnae (in the former, Zeus transforms into a man's wife; in the latter, Manannan mac Lir does the same thing) - as long as we bear in mind that gorlassar/Gorlois is not what/who he changed into. Gorlois as the product of the transformation is Geoffrey of Monmouth's reinterpretation - or misinterpretation - of the episode.
As Sawyl Benisel/Benuchel had been given a Biblical name, and some of his sons became saints in Wales and Ireland, it would make sense for the poet to celebrate a connection between him and the divine. We need not be put off by someone like Sawyl bearing the title Uther Pendragon, the Terrible Chief-dragon, as the draco was an object of veneration among the Sarmatians who settled about Ribchester. Pendragon could also represent the late Roman rank of Magister Draconum, master of the draco corp.
MADOG ELITHIR/ELIWLAD AND THE IRISH CONNECTION
To quote P.C. Bartram in his A CLASSICAL WELSH DICTIONARY, "He [Sawyl] is evidently the same as Samuel Chendisil the father of Matóc Ailithir and Sanctan by Deichter daughter of Muredach Muinderg, king of Ulster (MIS §1 in EWGT p.32)."
Deichter is an interesting name. A much earlier Deichter was the mother of the famous Irish hero Cuchulainn, who was first called Sétanta. Scholars are still debating whether Sétanta should be related to the name of the Setantii tribe in Britain. Sawyl ruled over what was once the Setantii tribal region.
If this Deichter were also Arthur's real mother, then we could once again account for why subsequent Arthurs all belonged to Irish-founded dynasties in Britain. And this is a requirement for ANY identification of the earlier Dark Age Arthur.
In fact, my main reason for settling on this particular theory for a famous Northern Arthur of the 6th century is precisely because I've been unable to find another who has demonstrable Irish ties of any sort. For example, we cannot link an Arthur at York with the Irish. Nor can we link an Arthur in the Irthing Valley with the Irish. WHAT IT ALL COMES DOWN TO IS THIS SIMPLE FACT: FOR IRISH-DESCENDED ROYAL FAMILIES IN THE FOLLOWING GENERATION (7TH CENTURY) TO NAME THEIR SONS ARTHUR, THEY HAD TO HAVE A VERY GOOD REASON FOR FINDING THE NAME TO BE IMPORTANT. AND THE ONLY CONCEIVABLE REASON FOR THAT WOULD BE IF THE FAMOUS ARTHUR WAS HIBERNO-BRITISH IN TERMS OF HIS LINE OF DESCENT. ONE MIGHT TRY AND MAKE A CASE FOR HIS HAVING MARRIED AN IRISH WOMAN, AS GEOFFREY OF MONMOUTH'S GUINEVERE IS PLAINLY THE IRISH SOVEREIGNTY GODDESS FINDABHAIR (SOMETHING I HAVE DISCUSSED AT LENGTH ELSEWHERE). BUT THAT IS FICTION; ARTHUR HAD TO POSSESS FINDABHAIR BEFORE HE COULD CONQUER IRELAND. WE HAVE NO OTHER EVIDENCE THAT ARTHUR HAD AN IRISH WIFE. THE ONLY OTHER POSSIBILITY IS THAT THE 6TH CENTURY ARTHUR HAD AMONG HIS RETINUE IRISH MERCENARIES. THEY WERE SO IMPRESSED WITH AND FOND OF THEIR BRITISH LEADER THAT HIS REPUTATION SPREAD TO DYFED AND DALRIADA. UNFORTUNATELY, WE CANNOT PROVE THAT ANY SUCH IRISH MERCENARIES WERE USED BY ARTHUR. WHAT WE CAN PROVE IS THAT SAWYL MARRIED THE DAUGHTER OF AN IMPORTANT KING AMONG THE IRISH. IF ONE OF HIS SONS BY THIS PRINCESS WERE ARTHUR, WE CAN ACCOUNT FOR THE POPULARITY OF THE NAME IN THE SUBSEQUENT GENERATION.
THE HOME OF SAWYL BENISEL: SAMLESBURY BY RIBCHESTER
Samlesbury Church on the River Ribble
For a nice history of Samlesbury, see
http://www.britishhistory.ac.uk/vch/lancs/vol6/pp303-313.
My own extensive treatment of the place-name’s etymology is as follows:
Sawyl (Samuel) Benisel ("Low-head"), another son of Pabo, is birth-dated c. 480. On the Ribble, not far south of “regio Dunutinga”, is a town called Samlesbury. The place-name expert Ekwall has Samlesbury as “Etymology obscure”, but then proposes OE sceamol, “bench”, as its first element, possibly in the topographical sense of “ledge”. Mills follows Ekwall by saying that this place-name is probably derived from scamol plus burh (dative byrig). However, sceamol/scamol is not found in other place-names where a “ledge” is being designated. Instead, the word scelf/scielf/scylfe, “shelf of level or gently sloping ground, ledge” is used.
The complete history of this place-name has been kindly supplied by Mr. Bruce Jackson, Lancashire County Archivist:
A D Mills: 'A Dictionary of English Place-Names'; Oxford University Press, 1991, page 284
'Samlesbury Lancs. Samelesbure 1188. Probably "stronghold near a shelf or ledge of land". Old English scamol + burh (dative byrig).'
David Mills: 'The Place Names of Lancashire'; Batsford, 1976 (reprinted
1986), page 130
'? burh on a shelf of land (OE sceamol + -es (possessive) + burh, in the
form byrig (dative)
Samerisberia 1179 (Latin)
Samelesbure 1188
Samlesbiry 1246
The original settlement was probably around the church which stands by the R. Ribble, at the foot of the 168 foot ridge to which the first element may refer. The derivation from OE sceamol, however, involves taking as base later forms of the name in 'sh-', such as Shamplesbiry 1246, which, though not uncommon, are far less frequent than forms in 's-'. If the 's-' forms are original, the etymology is less certain. There is much variation in the representation of the first element in early records - e.g. Sambisbury c.1300, Sammysburi 1524, Samsbury 1577. There is today no village around the church; the main settlement moved to the south, to SAMLESBURY BOTTOMS, (Old English botm, 'valley bottom', here referring to the valley of the R. Darwen in which the hamlet stands), where a community grew up around the cotton mill which was built there c1784.'
Eilert Ekwall: 'The Concise Oxford Dictionary of English Place-Names';
Oxford University Press, 1960, page 403
'Samlesbury La [Samerisberia 1179, Samelesbure 1188, -bur 1212,
Schamelesbiry 1246, Scamelsbyry 1277. Etymology obscure. If the name originally began in Sh-, the first element may be Old English sceamol 'bench' &c. in some topographical sense such as "ledge".'
Eilert Ekwall: 'The Place-Names of Lancashire'; Manchester University
Press, 1922, page 69
'Samlesbury (on the Ribble, E. of Preston): Samerisberia 1179, Samelesbure
1188, 1194, Samelesbur', Samelisbur' 1212, Samelesbiri 1238. Samelesbiry,
Samelesbiri, (de Samlebir, Samlesbiry, Samplesbiry) 1246, de Samelesburi
1252, Samlisbyri 1258, Samlesbury 1267, 1311 etc., Samlisbury, Sampnelbiry,
Sampnesbiry 1278, Samesbury 1276, 1278, Samlesbur' 1332, Samsbury 1577;
Shamplesbiry, de Schamelesbiry, -byr 1246, Scamelesbyry, Shampelesbyri,
Shapnesbyri 1277.
The old chapel of Samlesbury stands on the S. bank of the Ribble, with Samlesbury Lower Hall some way off on the river. I take this to be the site of the original Samlesbury. The etymology is much complicated by the variety of the early spellings. The forms with S- are in the majority, but there are a good many with Sh-, and it is not easy to see why S- should have been replaced by Sh-, whereas S- for Sh- is easily explained by Norman influence. If the original form had Sh-, I would compare the following names: Shamele (hundred Kent) 1275; Shalmsford (Kent); Shamelesford 1285, Sahameleford 1275, perhaps Shamblehurst (Hants): Samelherst, Scamelherst' 1176, Schameleshurste 1316. All these may contain Old English sceamol "bench, stool," or some derivative of it.....The meaning of this word in topographical use is not clear, but very likely it may have been something like "ledge, shelf".....In this case the word might refer to a ledge on the bank of the Ribble. In reality, Samlesbury Lower Hall stands on a slight ledge (c 50 ft above sea level), which stretches as far as the church.
If the spellings in Sh- are to be disregarded the etymology is much more difficult. The first element is hardly the personal noun Samuel . It it is a personal noun, as the early forms rather suggest, it may be a derivative of the stem Sam- found in German names. This stem is not found in English names, but the related stem Som occurs in Old English Soemel and perhaps in the first element of Semington, Semley, Wilts. Burh in this name, as in Salesbury, may mean "fortified house, fort" or "manor"...’
Henry Cecil Wyld and T Oakes Hirst: 'The Place Names of Lancashire';
Constable, 1911, page 226
'Samlesbury
1178-79 in Samesberia
1187-88 de Samelesbure
1189-94 Samlisburi
1227 Samlesbiri
1228 Samlesbyr
1246 Samelesbiri
1259 Samelebir
The first element is undoubtedly the Hebrew personal noun Samuel. This does not appear to have been popular amongst the English in early times.....It is not recorded by Bjorkman [Erik Bjorkman: 'Nordische Personennamen in England'; Halle, 1910] as having been adopted by any Norseman in this country, but Rygh mentions a Norwegian place name Samuelrud ["Norske Gaardnavne Kristiana", 1897, volume ii, page 201]. In volume i the same writer records Samerud (pp 7 and 9), but says that this is possibly a Modern name.'
John Sephton: 'A Handbook of Lancashire Place-Names': Henry Young, 1913, page 23
'A parish 4 miles east of Preston. Early forms are Samerisberia,
Samelesbure. First theme is the scriptural name Samuel . Ancient Teutonic names are also found from the root Sama.....' .
I would suggest as a better etymology for Samlesbuy “Sawyl’s fort”. There are, for example, Sawyl place-names in Wales (Llansawel, Pistyll Sawyl, now Ffynnon Sawyl). Richard Coates, of the Department of Linguistics and English Language at The University of Sussex, says of Samlesbury as “Samuel’s Burg”:
“After a bit of extra research, it seems that all the spellings in <Sh-> and the like are from just 2 years in Lancashire assize roll entries (1246 and 1277). That makes them look more like the odd ones out and <S-> more like the norm. I'm coming round to preferring your interpretation, even though Ekwall in PN La (p. 69) simply rejects the idea it might come from "Samuel". Brittonic *_Sam(w)e:l_ (<m> here is vee with a tilde - nasalized [v]) is a good etymon for the majority of the forms, including the modern one, of course.”
Dr. Andrew Breeze of Pamplona, another noted expert on British place-names, agrees with Dr. Coates:
“I finally looked up _Samlesbury_ last night and feel sure you are right. The form surely contains the Cumbric equivalent of Welsh _Sawyl_<_Samuel_. Your explanation of this toponym in north Lancashire is thus new evidence for Celtic survival in Anglo-Saxon times.”
Brythonic place-name expert Alan James also has signed on to the idea that Samlesbury is from the name Samuel:
"Checking LHEB p415 confirms that the medial consonant in Proto/Old Welsh *Saμuil would have remained audibly nasal through the 6th – 9th centuries, and could have been adopted into OE as *Samɪl or *Samel, and that name could very well be the specific in Samlesbury.However, we need to be clear that *(æt) Samelesbyrig is an English p-n formation, not a Celtic one, formed with anglicised *Samel, not *Saμuil, and certainly not Middle-Modern Welsh Sawyl. The fact that the specific is an anglicised version of a Brittonic-influenced latinate form of a Hebrew name is no more evidence of Celtic survival than it is of Hebrew survival. The eponymous *Samel need not have known a single word of Welsh. It only tells us that there had been some transmission of personal names from Brittonic to OE, presumably by bilinguals (probably mothers?) at some point during the period of anglicisation, and there’s plenty of evidence to support the judgement that, in what became Lancashire, that was quite a long and gradual process.
You're probably right in your suggestions that Samel could have originated as an anglicised, Old English, form of proto-Welsh *Saμuil, but as *(æt) Samelesbyrig is an English p-n formation, not a Celtic one, we can't assume that Samel of Samlesbury was, or spoke, Welsh (Brittonic, Cumbric). By the time the place was named, Samel could have become current as a personal name among monolingual Old English speakers. So Samel of Samlesbury can't be identified with any certainty with anyone named Sawyl.
As for Samlesbury being an anglicized version of a place originally named for a 5th century Sawyl, I wouldn't rule that out, but it would mean Sawyl had been adopted into OE not only a personal name but as a figure of local legend. I'm always doubtful about place-names being 'translated', it does happen, but it's not normal. But if Sawyl > Samel featured in folklore among English speakers, they might have associated the site with him and given it that name.
When it comes to the family of Sawyl being placed as you have suggested [see below under the section on "Pabo Post Prydain and His Sons (A Map)"], I would agree that some kind of 'legendary mapping' went on in the central middle ages, maybe starting during the time of the Cumbrian kingdom in the 10th century and continuing through the 11th and into the 12th, where figures in local folklore and poetry were associated with particular places, though whether any of those identifications relate to what really happened half a millennium earlier is, at best, unproveable."
Bremetennacum Veteranorum, Ribchester Roman Fort
Bremetennacum
NEW EXCAVATIONS AT THE RIBCHESTER FORT
An excavation project within the Roman fort at Ribchester has only recently been undertaken by the archaeology department of the University of Central Lancaster:
http://www.uclan.ac.uk/news/ribchester-roman-dig-bbc.php
When I wrote to Dr. Duncan Sayer, one of the directors of the dig, and asked if they had yet found any evidence for sub-Roman use of Bremetennacum Veteranorum, he replied with this exciting news:
“Yes, I believe we have identified some evidence of sub-Roman occupation within the fort at Ribchester. Certainly the abandonment date of AD370 is no longer really tenable and at this early state in the project we are reasonably convinced they have structures and workshops that relate to a later-Roman and sub Roman phase of activity.”
PABO POST PRYDAIN AND HIS SONS (A MAP)
Pabo in the earliest, most reliable genealogy (the Harleian) is the son of Pabo son of Ceneu. Later pedigrees intrude a Arthwys and Mar, but P.C. Bartram is surely right in saying that the earlier line of descent is "more correct, being chronologically more satisfactory."
The above map shows the geographical relationship of Pabo Post Prydain (of the Papcastle Roman fort in Cumbria) and his "sons" Cerwyd(d), an eponym for the Carvetii tribe, Dunot of Dentdale (see https://mistshadows.blogspot.com/2020/02/why-sawyl-benisel-is-listed-between.html) and Sawyl of Samlesbury near the Ribchester Roman fort. Note that Papcastle is on the Derwent, and the fort there was called Derventio. This matches the name of the Darwen River at Samlesbury, another Derwent.
Sawyl's son St. Asa belongs at Llanasa and Llanelwy/St. Asaph just a little to the SW of Samlesbury in Flintshire, while a church to his son Sanctan can be found at Kirksanton in southwestern Cumbria:
Sawyl's son St. Asa belongs at Llanasa and Llanelwy/St. Asaph just a little to the SW of Samlesbury in Flintshire, while a church to his son Sanctan can be found at Kirksanton in southwestern Cumbria:
For more on Sanctan, see https://books.google.com/books?id=a_1fAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA47&lpg=PA47&dq=chendisil&source=bl&ots=hy_TsaWT3F&sig=ACfU3U0PeMe8M8291HhlEH9pgQ5zJssvpg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjL2tLCmebgAhUSip4KHaB1A-MQ6AEwB3oECAgQAQ#v=onepage&q=chendisil&f=false.
The headwaters of the Rivers Dent and Ribble are literally right next to each other:
THE SETANTII TRIBE
Sawyl Benisel at Ribchester inhabited a region that was once controlled by a Romano-British tribe called the Setantii. The Setantii tribal territory embraced the Ribble, Samlesbury and Ribchester's Roman fort.
From A.L.F Rivet & Colin Smith’s The Place-names of Roman Britain, p 456-457:
“SETANTII
DERIVATION. This ethnic name is mysterious; there seem to be no British roots visible, and very few analogues anywhere of names in Set-. It is tempting, in view of Ptolemy's variants which show Seg- (Seg-) both for the port-name and the river-name, to suspect some confusion with the Seg- of Segontium, a possibility that occurred to Rhys (1904) 315 with regard to the river, though eventually he seems.to wish to main tain Setantii as a proper form. The strongest argument for so doing is provided by Watson CPNS 25, who points out that the first name of the Irish hero Cuchulainn was Setanta (from an earlier *Setant(os) : 'the Setantii were an ancient British tribe near Liverpool. . . the inference is that Setanta means "a Setantian" and that Cuchulainn was of British origin'. But the relation between these two names has been questioned. There is a full exposition of the problem by Guyonvarc'h in Ogam, XIII, (1961), 587-98, with discussion of views of Mac Neill, Osborne, and others, including Brittonic-Goidelic transferences in both historical and phonetic aspects. The essence of the matter is that it is tempting to see in this name Irish sét ('path'; = British *sento-, for which see CLAUSENTUM), but *-ant- suffix (as in DECANTAE) is Brittonic only, for -nt- does not exist in Goidelic. The name might be based on a divine name *Setantios, not otherwise known, and he in turn might be related etymologically and by sense to the goddess Sentona, perhaps 'wayfarer' (see further TRISANTONA). Clearly there is an additional problem in reconciling the a/e vowels in these forms (Trisantona, Gaulish Santones) if they are indeed connected. There, for the présent, the matter rests; but it is as well to reiterate that one cannot base too much speculation on forms recorded by Ptolemy alone, particularly when, in numbers, the MSS of his work record attractive variants.
IDENTIFICATION. Presumably a minor tribe, but since they appear only as part of a 'descriptive' name in the coastal list (next entry) and not in their own right in the full list of tribes, they probably formed part of the Brigantian confederacy. If the river name seteia is directly connected with them, they should have stretched along the Lancashire coast from the Mersey to Fleetwood.”
[1]
Ymddiddan Arthur a'r Eryr
Jes. MS 3
Llyma yr mod y treythir o englynyon yr eryr
Es ryfedaf kann wyf bard.
o vlaen dar ae vric yn hard.
py edrych eryr py chward.
Arthur bellglot ordiwes.
arth llu llewenyd achles.
yr eryr gynt ath weles.
Ys ryfedaf o tu myr
as gofynnaf yn vyuyr
py chward py edrych eryr.
Arthur bellglot engyhynt
arth llu llew[e]nyd dremynt
yr eryr ath welas gynt.
Yr eryr a seif ymbric dar.
[pei] hanfut o ryw adar
ny byd[ut] na dof na gwar.
Arthur gl[edy]fawc aruthyr
ny seif dy alon rac dy ruthyr
mi yw mab madawc [uab] uthyr.
Yr eryr ny wn dy ryw
a dreigla lgyngoet kernyw
mab madawc uab uthur nyt [byw].
Arthur ieith ****r*lit
***h gwyr * nyt gwaret lit
eliwlat gynt ym gelwit.
Yr eryr golwc diuei
ar dy barabyl nyt oes vei
ae ti eliwlat vy nei.
Arthur dihafarch ffossawc.
diarwrein arllwybrawt
ys gwiw kystlwn o honawt.
Yr eryr barabyl eglur
a dywedy di wrth arthur
beth yssyd drwc y wneuthur.
Medylyaw drwc drwy aferdwl
a hir drigyaw yny medwl.
rygelwit pechawt ardwl.
Yr eryr barabyl diwc.
am a dywedy yn amlwc.
y wneuthur beth yssyd drwc.
Medylyaw brat anghywir
a chelu medwl yn hir.
kwl a phechawt y gelwir.
Yr eryr barabyl tawel
am a dywedy di heb ymgel
beth am peir fford y ochel.
Gwediaw duw pob pylgeint
a damunaw kereifyeint
ac er[chi]* canhorthwy seint.
Yr eryr parabyl doethaf
yttyhun ygouynnaf.
bod crist py delw y haedaf.
Karu duw o bryt vnyawn
ac erchi arch kyfyawn
ath ved nef a bydawl dawn.
Yr eryr gwir euenygi
ys llwyr y gorfynnaf ytti.
ae da gan grist y voli.
Arthur gwryt gadarnaf
arth gwyr gwrodeu pob eithyaf.
pob yspryt molet y naf.
Yr eryr ratlawn blegyt
athovynnaf heb ergryt
pwy yssyd naf ar pob yspryt.
Arthur nyt segur lafneu
rudyeist ongyr yggwaetfreu
crist yw cret vi nam amheu.
Yr eryr ratlawn adef
ath ovynnaf o hyt llef
beth oreu y geissyaw nef.
Ediuarwch am drossed
a gobeth ran dang*nefed
hyñ ath beir yr drugared.
Yr eryr barabyl didlawt
ath ofyñaf arderchawc ardraeithawt
beth waethaf gyt a phechawt.
Arthur arderchawc doeth|ieith
gwedy profer pob kyfyeith
gwaethaf yw barñ añobeith.
Yr eryr barabyl gynyd.
ath ofynnaf dros dofyd
o añobeith beth yssyd.
Haedu hirboen uffernawl
a cholli duw yn dragywydawl
a chael cwymp anesgwrawl.
Yr eryr [i]eith ymadaw
ath lwyr ofynnaf rac llaw
ae gwell dim no gobeithaw.
Arthur arderchawc kyman
or myn eluyd kael kyfran
wrth gadarn gobeithet gwañ.
Yr eryr parabyl kywir
yttyhun y gofynnir
ponyt kadarn perchen tir.
Arthur geldyfawc wy*t
*na choll dofyd yr alaf
y kydernit ywr pennaf.
Yr eryr parabyl diheu
ath ovynnaf ar eireu
ponyt wyf gadarn inheu.
Arthur peñ kadoed kernyw
arderchawc luydawc lyw
y pennaf kydernit y[w] [d]yw.
Yr eryr ieith diarfford
gnawt gogorus ualdord
beth a ryd duw yr gosgord.
Gosgord nyw kywir voli
ac nyt kywir gyfarchei
ny dyt duw vessur arnei.
Yr eryr nefaw[l] dy̴ghet
or ny chaffaf y welet
beth a wna crist yr ae kret.
Arthur wydua llewenyd
wyt lluoessawc argletryd
ty hun dydbrawt ae gwybyd.
Yr eryr geir diamuarn
ath ofynnaf yn gadarn
ae dydbrawt y rodir y varn.
Arthur arderchawc wydua
yth dyd dyffed ny phalla
duw ehun a varn yna.
Yr eryr [barabyl cyhoed]
ath ovyn perchen * toruoed
beth dydbrawt a wna y pobloed.
Arthur arderchawc dam|re
arth gwyr wirodeu heilde
yna y gwybyd pawb y le.
Mi ae gofynneis y goffeiryeit
ac y esgyb ac y y̴gneit
pa beth oreu rac eneit.
Pader a maeyeit a bendigedic gredo
Ae cano rac eneit
hyt angheu goreu gordyfnot.
Ys kyrchych fford a delych
dy allu vyd da dangnofed
nyth didra ar adneu reddruga.
Syberw segur dolur
Ar eu knawt mynet dros vessur
ys dir nychyaw ny bo pur.
Anudon am dir a brat arglwyd
a diuaño dy law gar
dyd | brawt bydawt ediuar.
Ac velly y teruyna eglynyon yr eryr.
Yr eryr barabl difrad,
Os ti ydyw Eliwlad,
Ai gwiw ymladd am danad?
Arthur ddihafarch ateb,
Ni saif gelyn i'th wyneb,
Rhag angau ni ddiainc neb.
Yr eryr iaith ddiymgel,
A allai neb drwy ryfel
Yn fyw eilwaith dy gaffel?
Arthur bendefig haelion,
O chredir geiriau'r Ganon,
A Duw ni thycia ymryson.
SOURCE
Williams, Ifor. "Ymddiddan Arthur a'r Eryr" Bulletin of the Board of Celtic Studies. vol. 2. (1925-25) p. 269-86
[2]
cafell (pl. -au/-oedd only) < cavella ‘sanctuary, temple, cell’, 14th c. +
"For semantic reasons, the interpretation of GPC (as a variant of cawell, see below) seems unlikely to me. I should rather presume a double meaning of British Latin cavella. The difference of W -f-(-v-) : -w- (OW kauell) could have been introduced as a means of differentiation."
from Dating the loanwords: Latin suffixes in Welsh (and their Celtic congeners) by Stefan Zimmer
"As cawell and cafell are phonological variants of the same word, you could easily make a case that they originally had the same semantic range."
- Simon Rodway (personal correspondence)
- Simon Rodway (personal correspondence)
